Hmmm. #Zimmerman Jury Asks for Clarification on Manslaughter?

Posted on | July 13, 2013 | 33 Comments

#Zimmerman jury reportedly asking judge for clarification in regard to manslaughter, i.e., probably already decided no murder conviction.

— Robert Stacy McCain (@rsmccain) July 13, 2013

There is no other way to interpret this: If a second-degree murder conviction were still under consideration, the jury would not be asking about the lesser offense of manslaughter. And the fact that the jury needed clarification — I don’t know what that means.

On the other hand, it may be that the jury is just asking questions, and we shouldn’t read too much into this. I’m willing to bet $100 Zimmerman won’t get a murder conviction, but I’d have bet that even before the prosecution finished. Now the question has got to be “reasonable doubt” on manslaughter. Here’s what CNN reports:

The six women deliberating George Zimmerman’s fate asked the court Saturday evening for clarification on the instructions regarding manslaughter, the judge said.
That couldn’t have even been a question a few days ago: Judge Debra Nelson ruled Thursday, over the defense’s vehement objection, to include manslaughter as an option for jurors, in addition to the second-degree murder charge. Their third option would be to find Zimmerman not guilty.
The question — which was read out in court, without the jurors present, shortly before 6 p.m. Saturday — was the first posed by the jury since late Friday afternoon, when jurors requested an inventory of evidence. After the question on the manslaughter charge, lawyers from both sides approached Nelson’s bench; their comments could not be heard.
The judge then said the court would recess for 30 minutes. Lawyers returned to the Sanford, Florida, courtroom shortly before 6:40 p.m., at which time the jury had deliberated for 13 hours total.
After some back-and-forth, and shortly before the judge announced that the jury had ordered dinner, prosecutors and defense lawyers agreed to a response to the jury’s question — basically asking for more detail. “The court cannot engage in general discussions but may be able to address a specific question regarding clarification of the instructions regarding manslaughter,” their joint response to the jury says. “If you have a specific question, please submit it.”

Anthony Branca at Legal Insurrection says this was such a “dirty prosecution” that there is no way a conviction will withstand appeal. And therefore, maybe kind of a win-win: Conviction on manslaughter, so no riots, and then sometime next year the verdict is overturned on appeal. Nobody’s going to riot about that.

BTW, the defense closing argument sucked. It just did. The prosecution was much more emotional in their closing arguments.

It’s an all-[woman jury and, y’know, feelings.

The jury ordered dinner and is apparently going to work late tonight.

Category: Uncategorized

Comments

33 Responses to “Hmmm. #Zimmerman Jury Asks for Clarification on Manslaughter?”

MrEvilMatt
July 13th, 2013 @ 7:43 pm

Hmmm. #Zimmerman Jury Asks for Clarification on Manslaughter?: #Zimmerman jury reportedly asking judge for cla… http://t.co/REDdmQBUsn
jwbrown1969
July 13th, 2013 @ 7:43 pm

Hmmm. #Zimmerman Jury Asks for Clarification on Manslaughter?: #Zimmerman jury reportedly asking judge for cla… http://t.co/0fqlPfO3g6
Lockestep1776
July 13th, 2013 @ 7:43 pm

Hmmm. #Zimmerman Jury Asks for Clarification on Manslaughter?: #Zimmerman jury reportedly asking judge for cla… http://t.co/vRUgDsRc3Y
CHideout
July 13th, 2013 @ 7:43 pm

Hmmm. #Zimmerman Jury Asks for Clarification on Manslaughter?: #Zimmerman jury reportedly asking judge for cla… http://t.co/cOdTc7at5C
Citzcom
July 13th, 2013 @ 7:44 pm

Hmmm. #Zimmerman Jury Asks for Clarification on Manslaughter?: #Zimmerman jury reportedly asking judge for cla… http://t.co/fc475IRevL
thatMrGguy
July 13th, 2013 @ 7:52 pm

Hmmm. #Zimmerman Jury Asks for Clarification on Manslaughter? http://t.co/ZahxyX4sLR
preciseBlogs
July 13th, 2013 @ 7:54 pm

Hmmm. #Zimmerman Jury Asks for Clarification on Manslaughter http://t.co/mQwVRueHZK #news #conservative #uncategorized
Mike G.
July 13th, 2013 @ 7:55 pm

Don’t know if this is true or not, but I overheard someone say that according to FL law, the judge can overturn the jury’s verdict if the judge thinks it’s wrong. Remember, IANAL so YMMV.
rsmccain
July 13th, 2013 @ 7:56 pm

Hmmm. #Zimmerman Jury Asks for Clarification on Manslaughter? http://t.co/pXmAOUT3VL What does it mean? @LawSelfDefense #tcot
BeccaJLower
July 13th, 2013 @ 7:56 pm

RT @rsmccain: Hmmm. #Zimmerman Jury Asks for Clarification on Manslaughter? http://t.co/pXmAOUT3VL What does it mean? @LawSelfDefense #tcot
anonymous
July 13th, 2013 @ 8:11 pm

Gee, wouldn’t it be great if a jury decides to “split the difference” between not guilty and not murder2? Well, it wouldn’t be for George who would have to wait for the appeal process while sitting in the general population of a Florida prison.

I have seen the inside of CIs in Florida and I wouldn’t want to spend a year there trusting in the good will of a bunch of gang-bangers and skin-heads. Those odds are not good…
Mm
July 13th, 2013 @ 8:13 pm

That is not just Florida, it’s everywhere. It’s called a judgment notwithstanding the verdict. Don’t hold your breath for that.
Rick Kulacki Jr.
July 13th, 2013 @ 8:13 pm

Judges can override a guilty verdict to not guilty but CANNOT override not guilty to guilty.
robertstacymccain
July 13th, 2013 @ 8:27 pm

Yeah, I know: Everybody whose legal judgment I trust says the judge should have dismissed the case after the prosecution rested its case. And a lot of people (e.g., Stranahan) say Zimmerman never should have been charged to begin with.

On the other hand — and I know this isn’t a viewpoint heard much on “our side,” as it were — you’ve got a teenager who walked to the story to get Skittles and tea and ended up getting shot to death by this Barney Fife-type character. It really is kind of hard to look at all the details of this case and say that the shooting of Trayvon could just be brushed aside: “Oops.”

This ambiguity — the difficulty of knowing exactly what happened, why and how, the unusual circumstances all around — makes it a very unfortunate kind of case to be inflated into a racially-charged national drama. The national media have been grossly irresponsible, in much the way they were in the Rodney King and Duke lacrosse cases, hyping up one side of the story.

Whatever the result, I blame the media.
rsmccain
July 13th, 2013 @ 8:37 pm

RT @thatMrGguy: Hmmm. #Zimmerman Jury Asks for Clarification on Manslaughter? http://t.co/ZahxyX4sLR
rsmccain
July 13th, 2013 @ 8:37 pm

RT @MrEvilMatt: Hmmm. #Zimmerman Jury Asks for Clarification on Manslaughter?: #Zimmerman jury reportedly asking judge for cla… http://t.…
rsmccain
July 13th, 2013 @ 8:38 pm

RT @Lockestep1776: Hmmm. #Zimmerman Jury Asks for Clarification on Manslaughter?: #Zimmerman jury reportedly asking judge for cla… http:/…
Ryan
July 13th, 2013 @ 9:27 pm

On the basis of the merits and facts, George Zimmerman’s defense was the better of the closing statements. However, in making the closing argument about feelings RSM is correct.

I do think the jury is going to make its decision on the facts and evidence of the case, not feelings. But then again, I’m a person that responds to facts, to empirical evidence.
Evi L. Bloggerlady
July 13th, 2013 @ 9:33 pm

This is pure speculation: There is one hold out for a manslaughter conviction and five for acquittal.

And they are debating manslaughter.

The only result that I want to see is full acquittal. We cannot have White Hispanics rioting in the streets.

Unless it is Jessica Alba, Carmen Diaz, and Katherine Zeta Jones in wet T-shirts. Then Rule 5 prevails.
Evi L. Bloggerlady
July 13th, 2013 @ 9:34 pm

That is everywhere, but Judge Nelson overturn a guilty verdict…not a chance.
Evi L. Bloggerlady
July 13th, 2013 @ 9:34 pm

That is correct, once the jury acquits, it is over and no one can reverse it.
Evi L. Bloggerlady
July 13th, 2013 @ 9:36 pm

It is a tragedy. But I am convinced Trayvon threw the first punch (17 year olds do things like that). And that is all that matters when it comes to self defense under these circumstances.
Evi L. Bloggerlady
July 13th, 2013 @ 9:37 pm

Let’s hope the jury is like that too.
Mm
July 13th, 2013 @ 10:08 pm

Zeta jones is Welsh. But I’ll give you Rita Hayworth!
MrPaulRevere
July 13th, 2013 @ 10:11 pm

Hot off the press from Drew M. : Verdict Reached In Zimmerman Trial NOT GUILTY ON BOTH COUNTS: http://ace.mu.nu/archives/341623.php
anonymous
July 13th, 2013 @ 10:15 pm

I am shocked. I really expected the state to railroad GZ. Not sure how they failed to rig the verdict but the judge must have screwed up. Her superiors will not be happy with her.
anonymous
July 13th, 2013 @ 10:18 pm

I am sure the state remains convinced that GZ hit TM in the fist with his nose first and repeatedly. The state also believes that GZ banged his own head into the concrete to stage the murder scene.

It is their only logical conclusion…
anonymous
July 13th, 2013 @ 10:22 pm

CZJ is the best of Wales for sure. But when I first saw her on the screen I too assumed she was “White Hispanic”…

BTW, she spells “Catherine” with a “C” and not a “K.”
Ryan
July 13th, 2013 @ 11:03 pm

Yes, yes, a special Saturday Night rule five featuring Latinas, and a Welsh goddess!
Ryan
July 13th, 2013 @ 11:04 pm

God Bless the rule of law.
Ryan
July 13th, 2013 @ 11:05 pm

Judge Nelson just lost her bid for nomination to a higher court.
riverlifecallie
July 14th, 2013 @ 1:15 am

The teenager with the Skittles and tea was home. He made the decision to double back and teach the creepy-ass cracka a lesson by sucker punching him then pounding his head into the concrete. Zimmerman did the world a service by ridding it of a thug-in-training. And he also was defending his own life which we are still allowed to do in this country, last I checked. The only sympathy I feel for Trayvon was being saddled with two worthless parents who provided no guidance on how to be a decent human being.
Quartermaster
July 14th, 2013 @ 10:39 am

Zimmerman should never have been charged and Zimmerman is not a Barney Fife character. RSM, you are simply getting far too emotional in the matter and you are placing yourself in the same league as the libtard “journalists” when you act that way.