In 2014, Lane Moore (@hellolanemoore) became “Sex and Relationships Editor” at Cosmopolitan magazine, which has been giving young women bad advice for decades. When I was in college, I’d go visit girls in their dorms and read their magazines — Cosmo, Glamour, Mademoiselle, whatever — as part of my intelligence-gathering operation.
Like, what are girls into? So, I’d read their magazines and, holy crap, what miserable dreck it was! The sex-and-relationship advice was relentlessly bad and wrong. If you let women’s magazine advice columnists tell you how to run your love life, you’re probably going to end up as a lonely cat lady. And speaking of Lane Moore . . .
What brought her to my attention was an article headlined, “College Students Throw Shade at Enthusiastic Sexual Consent”:
According to a new poll from the Washington Post and the Kaiser Family Foundation, college students are still pretty confused as to how sexual consent actually works.
The poll, which surveyed 1,053 current and recent college students, aged 17 to 26, found that 83 percent of men and women are aware of the concept of “yes means yes” and what its purpose is — for the record, it means that only an enthusiastic “yes” from your partner means they consent, and the purpose is to prevent any sexual consent grey area — but only 69 percent of them felt it was a realistic practice, with 30 percent saying it wasn’t realistic at all. But whether or not its realistic doesn’t change the fact that it’s still extremely necessary.
According to the poll, at least 40 percent of the students thought that things like someone getting undressed, or getting a condom, or nodding in agreement indicated consent. Seriously? A nod? Or taking off clothes? I know 40 percent isn’t the majority but it’s a disturbingly high number of people who think that if a woman takes her shirt off she’s consenting to pretty much anything.
Sweetheart, where you from? I mean, does good old-fashioned spontaneity never happen where you’re from? Has the world so completely changed in the past 30 or 40 years that young folks no longer have basic animal passion? Must every hook-up now be negotiated like a spending bill in the House Ways and Means Committee? But never mind, please continue, Miss Moore:
Saying something like “sure” or “OK” isn’t exactly a yes, and in many cases, especially in violent situations, the victim may not say “no” because they’ve panicked and shut down, or they feel like they’ll be hurt or ignored if they do.
For example, one 22-year-old student polled said she’d had sex with a man even though she did not consent, and only said “OK” because “he was bigger, we were alone, he wouldn’t stop.”
And if there’s all of this uncertainty, why can’t we get people to agree that “yes means yes” and put that simple concept into practice? If “most people agree that no means no,” what’s so hard about adopting the opposite mantra?
What really breaks my heart about what that 22-year-old student said was that she started her statement with, “It wasn’t rape, but it was kind of similar.”
Welcome to 2015: College kids have forgotten how to fornicate.
Excuse my habitual sarcasm, but exactly what did this 22-year-old think was going to happen when she got alone with this guy? Don’t these kids ever listen to rock-and-roll music?
I remember every little thing
As if it happened only yesterday.
Parking by the lake,
And there was not another car in sight.
And I never had a girl,
Looking any better than you did.
And all the kids at school
They were wishing they were me that night.
And now our bodies are, oh, so close and tight
It never felt so good, it never felt so right . . .
Though it’s cold and lonely in the deep dark night,
I can see paradise by the dashboard light.
Ain’t no doubt about it, we were doubly blessed,
‘Cause we were barely 17 and we were barely dressed.
We didn’t need advice columns back in the day. We had rock-and-roll.
Have these kids been so incredibly sheltered they don’t understand how sex happens? Lane Moore isn’t really helping:
Therein lies the problem exactly. She knows she didn’t consent, she knows she didn’t say yes, she knows she only had sex with him because she thought he wouldn’t stop anyway, but she didn’t want it. That’s still rape. But because so many people still consider “no means no” the standard, there are many sexual assault victims who didn’t say no, but didn’t say yes, and they’re left feeling like they have only themselves to blame for not fighting back harder.
There has been some initial success with California’s “yes means yes” law enacted in 2014. A March Cosmopolitan article interviewed UCLA students about how it was going: “Freshman year we were like, ‘I guess it was my fault. I never really said no, so you can’t get mad at him,'” Morgan, a senior, said. “Now we’re a lot more aware that unless we’re saying we want to do this, then it’s not OK for it to happen.”
Exactly what is going on here? It’s mystifying to old-timers like me, perhaps because of a general decline in morality. Back in the day, there were Good Girls and Bad Girls, and everybody knew the difference. The Good Girls were hanging out at the Baptist Campus Ministry, and the Bad Girls were partying down at the Red Rooster Pub. You can guess where I was, right? But I was a Democrat back then, so . . .
Say whatever you want about double-standards and sexist “myths,” there were probably fewer misunderstandings over consent back when sex was something we learned about from Bad Girls and rock-and-roll songs.
Hey, hey, mama, said the way you move,
Gonna make you sweat, gonna make you groove.
Oh, oh, child, way you shake that thing,
Gonna make you burn, gonna make you sting.
Hey, hey, baby, when you walk that way,
Watch your honey drip, can’t keep away.
Which pretty much says it all, really. The proposition was simple to understand: “Do you want to rock-and-roll, or not? It’s up to you, sweetheart. There’s lots of Bad Girls and cold beer down at the Red Rooster Pub, and I’m feeling kind of thirsty.”
Meanwhile, there’s more from Miss Moore at Cosmo:
But interestingly, when the students in the Washington Post poll were asked what they thought would do the most to prevent sexual assault, a huge 93 percent of students said men simply needed to respect women more. This answer beat out things like drinking less (78 percent) and avoiding casual sex (64 percent).
Here’s a crazy idea: If you want men to respect you, be a Good Girl.
If you don’t want to rock-and-roll, you should spend your evenings at the Baptist Campus Ministry, praying for the lost souls of all those Bad Girls and hell-bound Democrat boys who are getting so drunk and having sex so “casual” they can’t even remember what happened, much less whether or not they consented to it.
Trying to pretend there is no difference between Good and Bad, believing you can indulge in drunkenness and fornication without risk or consequence? Trust me, I was a hell of a young fool back in the day, but I was never that kind of fool. And now, let’s rock-and-roll.
UPDATE: Welcome, Instapundit readers! Professor Reynolds asks, “Really, what’s the point of college anymore?” Indeed, campus life in 2015 brings to mind the immortal words of Joseph Blutarsky:
“Seven years of college down the drain.
Might as well join the f–king Peace Corps.”
Let’s face it: Animal House was “rape culture, because everything from the 1970s was “rape culture,” especially rock-and-roll.
Hey everyones favorite faux feminist slash child rapist Lena Dunham has written scenes for her show where women begging for sex is sexy and healthy.
This is something one learns by studying feminism. The “liberated” attitudes and behaviors promoted by so-called “pro-sex” feminists inevitably lead to sorrow, tragedy and hardship, which in turn give rise to radical “anti-sex” feminism, especially including lesbian feminism. When a teenager tries to live like The Cosmo Girl, she is playing a game in which men really have all the advantages. As soon as she starts losing that game — as inevitably she must, given basic human nature and the Law of Large Numbers — the would-be Cosmo Girl seeks to absolve herself from responsibility. It is not she who is at fault, nor does she perceive that other women have betrayed her by telling her lies about the “joy” of promiscuity. Instead, she blames her male partners and generalizes that blame to include all men — “patriarchy,” “male supremacy” — and thereby is radicalized.
When I was 9, we got invited to view Apollo 10 lift off. Our family sat next to Jimmy Doolittle in the viewing area. Dad did internal navigation for Mercury and Gemini and the radar for the F-4 and then F-15. Very cool times. My vicarious relationship with the F-4 got me a lot free drinks when I traveled around Israel during the summer of 1980.
In spite of the feminists’ drivel about consent and “rape culture”, I’m fairly certain the casual hook-up culture thrives as it always has…
What concerns me is the focus on consent—however it’s defined, as if “consent” is the sole determinant of what is and not acceptable or appropriate: I’ve “known” women who considered putting out an obligation, women who considered sex an issue of health or social status, or a “gift” or a “reward”, or a mere commodity, or even just a game, etc….
“Consent” in my experience was rarely central to the act, except when “NO!” was brought into it! When a woman was “hot to trot”, consent per se was only ever implied or assumed. These episodes weren’t rape though they may not have been always proper: I hold myself directly responsible for ruining at least two women’s marriages to other men years ago under the doctrine of “enthusiastic consent”; and I really, truly regret that now!
We’ve learned what “consent” means to the homosexual lobby during the Free Kate drama: i.e. the juvenile victim apparently “consented”, and one was labeled a “homophobe” if he disagreed, and therein lies the rub! “Consent” is a Pandora’s Box we do not want to open, so I’m inclined to dismiss the whole narrative on consent as a bare-faced deception with a sinister ulterior motive…
I hope so…
Oh, I’m well aware of the joke. I just enjoy missing the point.
While I once dated a girl taller than myself — and I’m 6’2″ — simple statistics will note that women seeking out men no larger than themselves are not going to be successful most of the time. How many eligible guys are there for the 5’4″, 115 lb coed who aren’t a lot bigger than she is?
She could move to Japan…
I denounce myself.
STFU. I just saw Boston (and Kansas) last Saturday and they rocked.
Indeed. When I hear people talk about what they say during sex, it just leaves me kind of boggled. In my experience, if sex is going well, you’re not capable of coherent speech.
The process of outlawing penis in vagina sex continues. Actually, with the combination of social pressure, estrogen and estrogen like compounds in the environment, young men aren’t as horny as traditionally. Young men recognize the dangers of marriage as Dr. Helen Smith and others have documented. With lower testosterone levels and good judgment, they are content to video game and wait for sexbots. The benefits of sex with women is becoming outweighed by the dangers. Just as lesbian feminist’s have always wanted.
Useless. Prior consent doesn’t imply future consent, so just because you have a written contract, she takes of her clothes, and hands you a condom, doesn’t mean you’re safe. Japan, here we come!
Naturally, I thoroughly denounce you! 🙂
“She was asking for it!” “That’s sexist!” “No, Your Honor, she was literally asking for it, begging and pleading, and being pretty graphic about how she wanted it.” “Can you prove that, young man?”
She knows she didn’t consent, she knows she didn’t say yes, she knows she only had sex with him because she thought he wouldn’t stop anyway, but she didn’t want it. That’s still rape.
No it isn’t.
Ya know, if we applied these same rules to any sales interaction, our economy would grind to a halt. I guess implied consent is a doomed closing technique.
In today’s music, the equivalent is “Girl, get in my truck.”
But they did manage to name both a single and an album after themselves. Talk about product placement. Most only managed the album.
Actually, it pretty much is: she never said yes, she never indicated yes, and failed to resist only because she had a legitimate (?) fear that he would rape her if she said no.
In sales, consent is always given, by signature or payment.
Are you a humorless literalist or a prophet?
That’s pretty cool. I met Jimmy Doolittle’s co-pilot (now Col. Dick Cole) on the airshow circuit a few years back.
She said “ok”, that means yes. There was no use of force or threats (or she’d tell us). Her being irrationally paranoid about rape doesn’t mean she was coerced into sex.
From the (bare) facts given, and the context, we can safely assume the mens rea required for rape was missing.
Probably the man had no idea what an emotionally broken sensitive snowflake he was hooking up with.
Almost certainly not a rape, then.
From the article: she knows she only had sex with him because she thought he wouldn’t stop anyway
Well, sorry, but tough. She’s a grown woman of 22 and her actions indicated consent. Unless her sex partner was clairvoyant, how the hell was he supposed to know her acquiescence was out of (alleged) fear? Unless, say, he was a hulking bog brute who cornered her in a dark alley and flashed a knife at her. But if it was one of those stories, she’d have told us.
To me, nothing in this tale indicates rape. It indicates regret sex.
If she’s not capable of saying “no” to sexual intercourse at the age of 22, there are always convents she can join.
The girl SAID “okay,” but because she didn’t say “yes” (just “okay”), this Cosmo freak says it was rape (even though the girl doesn’t)?
Even “yes means yes” is not enough for them. If the girl says yes for the wrong reasons, or for what she later decides are the wrong reasons, it is still rape.
Por que no los dos?
Dream of the Fisherman’s Wife would like to disagree.
I would totally listen to Malevolent Clown Virus, for the record.
As to your point, the lucky thing is that, at least for the moment, most people don’t really take these folks seriously, although how long it will be before everyone is completely terrified into conformity is an open question.
Not to brag but my wife is pretty much incommunicado for a couple of hours after sex. She doesn’t want to put in the necessary mental effort to talk or think about anything for that period.
Yes, I’ve always wondered why role models have to be sex, race, preferred fiddly bits, and favorite ice cream flavor matching to be valid.
I still have a mental image of Adm. Hooper standing at the Pearly Gates, cigarette dangling, looking at St. Peter’s big book of who gets in after he answered why it wasn’t computerized yet, and saying, “We’ve always done it that way isn’t a valid answer.”
When Boston was doing their initial tours after the release of their first album I heard they sucked because they couldn’t duplicate their studio sound…at least with just one guitarist.
I wonder how much of Japan’s “sex” problems are related to their (IMO) cultural embrace of escapism? They seem to me to be so totally enamored of anime, technology, gadgets, etc. that they no longer see any value in meatspace activities.
This could perhaps still be the echoes of having to confront their past (WWII) and the world’s reaction to that (firebombings, atomic bombings, surrender and cultural/social reconstruction).
My 2 cents, anywayz.
I don’t know what young men you’re talking to, friendo…
They made a documentary about it.
http://topdocumentaryfilms.com/no-sex-please-japanese/
Uh oh. Are we going to start applying the stereotypical husband-wife dynamics where the husband is supposed to be able to read the wife’s mind (“You know what I’m mad about!”) to sexual consent?
Get it in writing.
Can’t wait for some feminist to take her husband to court…
Thomas More?
I agree.
If the standard for rape is “he was bigger than me so I didn’t dare say anything but OK”, then most men are in big trouble.
In retrospect, I’m not really sure what was going on, because my dad was a milkman.
This is funny. My parents both have dark hair, and I was a little blonde girl. This was back in the days when milkmen still delivered to your door. And I was asked once, “Look at that hair! Was your daddy the milkman?” And I said “Yeaaah.” At the time, I didn’t understand the funny look. 😀
Where does it say that “She said “ok””? Somehow, I missed that. What she admits is that she didn’t say no, for the reasons she gave.
Or are you attempting to argue that by not saying no, and not resisting, the default answer is yes?
I was still single then… Part of me wants to believe those women’s marriages were doomed anyway and it wasn’t entirely my fault—I’ll never know though—and it wouldn’t absolve me in any case!
At the same time, she my well have felt intimidated, even if the guy couldn’t tell or was too intoxicated to notice (possibly indicating that drunken hookups are not necessarily conducive to decisions which one or more of the persons involved will not regret at some later point in time).
Perhaps, but how was he to know?
O’ course, as we’ve already seen, telling girls / women to be careful, to not put themselves in potentially dangerous situations, to watch after themselves, is sexist. Married men, I know, rapidly learn to read their wives’ minds (or, at least, learn that they SHOULD be able to!), but I’m not sure that the average guy can read the average girl’s mind and know, for example, that just because she’s naked in his bed she doesn’t REALLY want to make the beast with two backs.
Yes.
We use the phrase ‘Fire bad, tree pretty’ from _Buffy The Vampire Slayer_ to describe that state of mind.
They fixed that problem a while ago. When I first saw them in the mid-90s, they were touring with a full pipe organ that they raised up from behind the stage when it was needed.
I favor the economic explanation. Women have always had hypergamy, the tendency to prefer to marry up, and their decades-long recession has resulted in lots of young men who are bouncing around between temp jobs. They are thoroughly unattractive to all the young women whose dads had lifetime employment with a career advancement track.
Then, the problem is compounded by all the ambitious women who do have a man, but have to strictly deny any hint of ever wanting babies if they want to get ahead in their careers.
I predict that there will be some small bounceback in fertility, as the girls now reaching childbearing age may have lower standards from growing up with uncles that didn’t have steady jobs. However, I don’t think that their birthrate will ever really recover until they make a radical transformation in their culture to where women can have babies and their employers will welcome them back with open arms. (That is probably easier than trying to make women stop being ambitious.)
Sure, she may well have felt that way.
Legally, it doesn’t matter. The laws on rape are pretty clear in most jurisdictions – even if applying them to messy and contested real life situations is anything but clear.
Rape is when a man sexually penetrates a woman without her consent, AND without reasonable belief on his part that she consents.
The law doesn’t require men to be mind readers. If a girl is over the age of consent and – by her own apparent free will – alone and naked with you, and says “okay” to sex, and does nothing to resist your advances or otherwise indicate that she doesn’t consent, then it can’t be rape.
It says so above:
one 22-year-old student polled said she’d had sex with a man even though she did not consent, and only said “OK” because “he was bigger, we were alone, he wouldn’t stop.”
Or are you attempting to argue that by not saying no, and not resisting, the default answer is yes?
In such a case it wouldn’t be rape if the man reasonably believed it was consensual.
Say a girl comes back to your hotel room after a night of partying. She’s intoxicated but aware of her surroundings and able to talk and walk. She smiles when you make a move on her. She doesn’t say yes or no, but doesn’t stop you as you take her to bed. As far as you can tell, she’s a willing participant in your congress.
Is that rape? No. Not unless you had some reason to believe she did not, in fact, consent. For example – if you thought she was sleepwalking or hypnotised or was being threatened or blackmailed into it.
Or say you found a girl, paralytically drunk and lying in a hallway at a party. You drag her into a bedroom and perform a sexual act on her. You don’t know who she is.
Is that rape? Yes.
Sex doesn’t require a written contract or even the word “yes” to be perfectly legal. The law does not regard healthy, adult, sexually active people as being vulnerable wretches who need to be constantly monitored in the bedroom.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=769qie9npes
We need to take them seriously. We need to view them as an existential threat to our existence. Our world is built around competence and rationality…our world is a complex machine that demands both or it will stop functioning. I am pretty self sufficient but even I don’t know how to raise enough food to feed my family and if these fools get to where they want to go we will be forced to learn. Not sure but I am pretty sure I will run out of life before the first crop comes in…these are extremely deadly times we live in.
Back 200 years a group of idiots in power couldn’t really stop you from eating because most of us had farms. Now while we are laughing at these clowns they are busy destroying that which makes up civilization. Control the education and poof all this sh!t goes away.